Ep 269. - Exclusive: Sami Hamdi Speaks After His ICE Detention
This week on The Thinking Muslim, we have Clive Stafford Smith on the podcast to discuss the case of Dr Aafia Siddiqui, including the troubling role of Pakistani authorities in her abduction, the heartbreaking seizure of her children, and the broader issues of state complicity.
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Transcript - Thi
Introduction
0:01
Asalam allayikum and welcome back to the thinking Muslim. Thank you very much and welcome back to
0:06
London of course. Alhamdulillah. Well, the last few interviews I think we've uh done with you
0:11
Sami. We did one interview in Koala Lumpa. I mean our next interview was in Chicago and of course
0:16
our last interview was in LA. Uh I think you're quite happy to be back here in in London. Do you
0:22
think you'd ever hear that from me? I think to be honest it has been a roller coaster of a ride but I think when all is said and done I think that it's always good to be home it's
0:33
always good to be safe but one of the things that I will say is it's been incredible to see how the
0:41
um moved regardless of the borders whether it's in America whether it's in the UK so just as I'm
0:46
glad to be in London I'm glad that my brothers and sisters in America came out in force alhamdulillah
0:51
alhamdulillah good what I want to talk about today what happened to you. Uh I want to talk about your
0:58
detention for two weeks uh in an ICE detention center. Uh I want to talk about some of the sort
1:04
of broader implications of freedom of speech. We of course need to talk about the teams that alhamdulillah came together to help you uh over these past two weeks and give credit to uh the
1:14
brothers and sisters who worked like sometimes 24 hours. Subhan Allah. You know in in in uh getting
1:21
uh your release inshallah tala. Alhamdulillah. So, you know, there's a lot to talk about today. Uh,
Hours before detention
1:26
but I actually want to start with uh a a conversation you and I had a few hours before
1:33
your detention. So, uh, for our viewers, we were at a, uh, an event in Sacramento for care and,
1:40
uh, I think you and I were doing a Q&A on stage and I asked you one final question and, um, uh,
1:47
we were just about to finish and, uh, you asked to to make one final point and that was really a
1:53
point about uh, the right and about the left and the midterm elections and um, um, Subhan Allah,
2:01
I think you put the mic down and turned to me and said that uh this may be the last time I
2:06
get a chance to say this to an American audience. So, Subhan Allah, you know, a few hours later you were arrested, but I want to I want to focus in on the point you were making because I think that
2:17
had a lot to do with your arrest, the midterm elections, and your advice to American Muslims
2:22
and just Americans in general. Talk to me about that. Why do you think they they arrested you?
2:28
I think that one of the things that that that's worth starting with is I wouldn't necessarily
2:33
separate what's happening in America from my experience in detention. I'm wary of the audience separating the two because it's all linked to one another. One of the the crises that's taking
2:46
place in America at the moment is the battle between America first and Israel first. And that battle is so stark and is such is so much at the forefront that it's transcended party lines.
America First vs Israel first
2:56
You look at for example Mamani's victory in New York and you'll note that Mamani in the buildup
3:01
to the election found support to a great extent from the likes of Republicans like Marjorie Taylor
3:08
Green got praise from the likes of Tucker Carlson on the right got praise from the likes of Candice
3:14
etc and these others who celebrated Manni celebrated they might believe to be a strong word but I would say celebrated who celebrated Mamani for no other reason than that he put
3:23
America first. it transcended. A Republican was able to appreciate a Democrat because they were able to put America first while denouncing that who was supported by Republicans like Cuomo and
3:34
Eric Adams because they were Israel first. In other words, the point that I was making was that America now is no longer Republican and Democrat anymore. We keep talking about America
3:44
as if it's a duopoly. I don't think that the current midterm elections that are coming up or even the state of America at this moment in time is a battle between Republicans and
3:51
the Democrats. It's a battle between Israel first versus America first. It's about which
3:57
takes priority. Does the American citizen who's going bankrupt as a result of being unable to
4:02
afford medical bills? Does that ordinary American citizen who sees that their son or daughter is
4:08
struggling in the hospital and cannot rely on the state to bail them out because the state prefers to support Israel? Is it that America should be built on providing everything for the Israelis,
4:18
free health care for the Israelis, full weapons for the Israelis, paying for their army, paying for the Iron Dome, and paying for their genocide? Should America be a country that should
4:29
celebrate its decline because Israel is thriving? Or should they put America first? That's what's
4:35
at stake in the midterm elections. Which is why we saw that candidates are coming out like those in Massachusetts and the like who are saying, "I promise not to take Apac money being very much
4:44
aware that Americans are increasingly upset at the notion that Israel is coming first as opposed to
4:50
their own particular interest. The point here being is that the greatest attack on American
4:56
freedoms and the greatest attack on America is not actually the Muslim world or anything of the like. The greatest attack is actually coming from the Israelis who are demanding that Americans put
5:06
up with economic decline for the sake of Israel first. And therefore, the debate or the choice in
5:13
the upcoming midterm elections is which direction does America want to go. And one of the things
5:18
that we were arguing in Sacramento is that every American has a duty to save America. This isn't
5:24
about destroying America. How do you save America from the decline that Israel is imposing on the
5:30
Americans? On the way here, we were listening to uh Ben Shapiro clips that were being brought by
5:35
Tucker Carlson and these others. And Ben Shapiro was saying things like that if a young American can't afford to live in the area where they grew up, well, tough go somewhere else. In other words,
5:45
Ben Shapiro was saying that those billions of dollars being given to the Israelis, Israel deserves it. And you should celebrate that Israel gets it, even if you're forced
5:54
to leave your home. When you see those veterans who come back from service in the American army,
6:00
albeit for dubious missions abroad in Afghanistan, Iraq and the like. But in any in any case, when the veterans come back, the American government believes that it is preferable to
6:10
leave the veteran in the freezing cold of Chicago on the streets and give money to Israel rather
6:16
than spending that money that's going to Israel in order to give that veteran who served his country
6:21
probably sincerely believing in America, believing in the land of the brave, believing in the land of freedom of speech that that veteran freezing in the cold should thank his lord that Israel
6:31
is getting free healthcare and an iron dome while he starves and freezes in the cold. You look at,
6:37
for example, the unemployment crisis. You saw that Congress as a result of the shutdown, we've seen that 40 million Americans are being denied those SNAP benefits whereby they're able to buy food at
6:48
discounted costs. Now, Biden found $14 billion to give to the Israelis during the genocide. When a
6:53
hurricane ravaged through Florida, 8 billion was given first to the Israelis to restore their Iron
6:59
Dome and help them to commit genocide as opposed to being given to Florida to help them in the tornadoes and the like. 40 million Americans had those discounted benefits removed from them. The
7:11
cost of that 40 billion is less than the money that was given to the Israelis. The choice in
7:16
the midterm elections is should 40 million people starve for the sake of the Israelis or should we
7:23
feed 40 million Americans and tell the Israelis go sort your own issues outlaykumah. Now, before
Support CAIR
7:31
we proceed to our exclusive interview with Sami Hamdi, the first since his release from detention
7:36
in the United States, I would like to take a moment of your time to discuss an extraordinary
7:41
organization. The Council on American Islamic Relations Care played a vital role in advocating
7:47
for Sami's release. In fact, many of you know I was also in the states with Sammy and there was
7:52
a real fear that I might also be detained. K's legal and civil liberties team acted swiftly,
7:59
going beyond the usual to help me leave. Sami's case has made us realize that families are being
8:04
torn apart by ICE raids, unlawful detention, and US policies that continue to enable devastation in
8:11
Palestine, Gaza, and beyond. At this moment, silencing us is part of their strategy. From
8:18
college campuses to workplaces, students and advocates for Palestine are being censored,
8:23
punished, and threatened. If we cannot speak, we cannot challenge the policies that fuel injustice. This is where care remains resolute. Their mission is to protect civil liberties,
8:34
defend free speech, and empower American Muslims. Currently, they urgently need to expand their
8:40
frontline legal team. For lawyers and advocates who respond immediately when ICE detains a father,
8:47
when a student is censored, or when a community member is targeted for speaking out. Your support
8:53
directly funds these defenders. Every donation strengthens the legal shield that protects our
9:00
families and amplifies our voice for justice in Palestine. I invite you all to join this struggle.
9:08
Stand with care. Donate today to an organization that desperately needs our support. Follow the
9:15
onscreen link or scan the QR code. Alternatively, click on the link in the pinned comment.
9:24
And this is the point that was being made in that often American politics is talked about left and right. Left and right does not exist anymore. When Manny, a socialist left-wing politician is
9:36
talking about affordability in New York, the right-wingers of Marjgery said, "Well done,
9:41
Meani." When the right-wingers of Cuomo and Eric Adams and these others said, "I need to prioritize
9:47
Israel over New York." The right wing is in the same camps said, "How dare you? We're closer to
9:53
the left-wing socialist in this regard than we are to our fellow right-wing brethren." The point is,
9:58
we're no longer talking about traditional politics anymore because that support for the Israelis at the expense of the Americans has become so stark that we can no longer talk about Democrats and the
10:08
Republicans. And the final point that I will say is this in that when you look at what's happening in America, the American interest when you look at the crackdown on freedom of speech serves
10:19
whose interest here? If an American citizen says that I have my neighbor who's starving? We were
10:27
on a call yesterday with a few Americans. You'll remember this conversation where somebody on the group said that my neighbor comes to me to ask me for help to buy food. And I've got an American
10:39
family opposite me on the street who sent their kids over who asked me if they wanted help to
10:44
mow the lawn because they needed some money. They wanted money in exchange so they could buy their meal for the day. You were there. You heard that conversation by a white American who was telling
10:53
us that conversation at that time that when the American says that I've just seen more than $30
10:59
billion go to the Israelis. I think as an American we should give it to my neighbor and we should give it opposite and Israel says that we need to shut down that freedom of speech. We need to send
11:10
ICE to detain a family member. We need to send ICE to detain journalists who are talking about it. We need to pass laws in Congress to restrict the ability of the American to demand America first.
11:21
What interest does America have in restricting the freedom of speech for the sake of the Israelis? It
11:27
is to America's detriment to do so. And that's why this midterm elections, it has nothing to do with
11:33
the policy of what Washington is saying. It's about what is the message that you give to Tel Aviv. Will you sacrifice America's prosperity, America's freedoms? Will you sacrifice the land
11:46
of the brave, the land of the free speech as they like to call it for the sake of Tel Aviv? Or will
11:51
you say actually I should be America first? I should look after my fellow Americans and
11:56
actually I should prioritize those Americans and I should therefore vote accordingly. And I think now the Israel First Block is in such a hysteria that they've spent $50 billion to buy Tik Tok to
12:07
control the flow of information that goes to the Americans to prevent the change in public opinion
12:12
to stem the tide of rebellion, not against America. Rebellion against Israel first for
12:18
the sake of America. The Israel lobby is now in a hysterical fit whereby they're now buying CBS
Israeli Lobby
12:25
and bringing Barry Weiss to oversee CBS to control the flow of information to Americans to stem the
12:31
irresistible tide of the shift in public opinion in which the public are saying America first,
12:36
not Israel first. The war in the midterm elections is between America and Israel. Who takes priority?
12:43
Who comes first? Is it America and Israel? And the Americans are going to vote accordingly. I want to pick up on the point you made at the very end there and uh you almost uh established this idea
12:54
that the Israel first lobby is is weakening uh and it's on the decline. But of course there were two
13:01
uh figures I think that were quite instrumental in in your arrest. Amy Meckleberg, who also goes by the name of Amy Mech, uh, and Laura Luma. And these two individuals had some sort of, uh, status
13:13
within the State Department, within Homeland Security, and, uh, their tweets were responsible,
13:19
it seems to me, for your arrest. I mean, is uh and are the Israeli first lobby really in decline
13:27
across America or are they just recalibrating uh and and using their money and their re and their
13:33
efforts uh and their resources uh to to fight uh this narrative that was maybe temporarily some
13:41
would say uh established in these last two years. Let's expand the timeline for a second in order
13:47
to give a more clearer picture. Yeah. Tucker Carlson does an interview with Ted Cruz that
13:53
humiliates Ted Cruz. In which he says to Ted Cruz, why do you think you were elected? And he said, I'm elected to serve Israel first. That's one of the re the main reasons why I am elected. I was
14:04
taught in school that Israel comes first. I get Apac money and I should serve the Isra. And Tucker Carlson is so bewildered by that response in which he says, "But you're supposed to be American." And
14:12
Ted Cruz is humiliated in that. So Ted Cruz being the senator for Texas. The reason why I say let's
14:18
expand the timeline is that the Israel first lobby didn't come for me first. First they said
14:24
let's go after US citizens. Let's go after the mediassans. Let's go after other organizations
14:29
like care and the like. Let's go after American Muslims for Palestine. American citizens who are
14:35
looking for the interests of America and asserting that it should be America first over Israel first.
14:40
They dragged American Muslims for Palestine, American citizens through the courts in Michigan.
14:46
The judge before he looks at the case says before I look at the case it's come to my attention there may be foreign influence on the attorney general's office in bringing this case
14:55
I want to investigate this case first and the attorney general panics and drops the case against Americans of Palestine in Nevada they drag American Muslims for Palestine some students
15:05
American university students American citizens in the courts and says that they made Zionists feel
15:11
uncomfortable on campus the judge rules in Nevada very bewildered and says I don't understand am I
15:18
looking at a case before me in that an American expressed an opinion another American was offended
15:24
and therefore they brought the case here this is a land of freedom of speech case dismissed so they went after American citizens and realized we're not getting any ground here then they said okay
15:33
fine if we can't silence American citizens let's try and pass a law in Congress to shut American
15:40
citizens up when they're trying to advocate for America first over Israel first. So they
15:45
went and presented a bill in Congress through the Apac lobby and the like and the ADL in which they wanted to ban the boycott of Israel by Americans by imposing a fine of $1 million and jail time if
15:57
you were caught boycotting the Israelis. Ape was stunned to find that while many on the left were
16:03
quiet on the bill, Marjorie Taylor Green, Thomas Massie, and other Republicans came out and said,
16:08
"Hang on a second. We're America first. We're not Israel first. we won't we're not going to restrict
16:13
the rights and freedoms of these individuals of American citizens for the sake of a foreign government and the bill was kicked out. Then the Apac lobby and the extreme Israeli lobby said,
16:22
"Okay, we can't go after citizens. We can't go after their organizations. Let's go after non-citizens who are here on a green card." So they went after Mahmud Khaled. They arrested
16:32
Mahmud Khal and they tried to ship him to Louisiana into a court. Federal judge in New Jersey said that he has the right to freedom of speech. He has to be released. He can't be
16:41
deported. And then they appeal. He wins the appeal. And now they're trying still trying to catch him. But the reality is that they have failed to get Mahmud Khaled deported. Then they
16:50
went after student visa Romesa Oturk who wrote an oped criticizing the Israelis and arguing that
16:56
it's not in America's interest to support the Israelis. Romea Ostuk was picked up by ICE. She
17:01
was brought before the courts and the judge said, "We are a land of free speech. We are the land of the brave. It is unacceptable that a lady gets imprisoned for freedom of speech. Release her."
17:12
Then the Israel lobby said, "Oh my god, what am I supposed to do?" So they went from Meawi
17:17
in Colombia, another student visa who was doing protest in Colombia University. They put pressure
17:22
on Colombia University. They put pressure on the director who put pressure on Palestinian students. Masamei was detained, brought before the courts. But the land of free speech, the judges of the
17:32
land of free speech said he has the right to free speech. Release him. Mimi was released.
17:37
What do we do? How can we stop this irresistible momentum? Because at every turn, America first
17:43
wins. We want Israel first to win. How can we make America first to win? I know Dinish Duza finds a
17:51
video of Sami in Koala Lumpo in which Sami Hamdi says next to Jaladin and next to Muhammad Jal
17:58
where he tells an audience that because of social media, because you're raising your voice, because
18:04
you're speaking the truth, Americans are good people. Americans have good hearts. Americans are
18:10
hospitable. When you talk to them directly, their hearts change. Look at Tucker Carlson. Look at
18:16
Candace Owens. Look at all of these changes that we're seeing, including Matt Walsh, who today, at the time of this recording, is putting a whole post saying, "Guys, I swear I'm America first. I'm
18:26
not Israel first." After a backlash taking place, Denish Duza takes that video clip and writes
18:32
on top that jihadist terrorist sympathizers celebrates the spread of Islam in America by
18:37
Candace Owens and Tucker Carlson. Elon Musk, his AI Grock responds to Denish Duza and says there's
18:45
nothing in the video that remotely resembles what Dinish Duza is saying. But the Israel first lobby
18:50
of Dinish Duza and Ted Cruz, Ted Cruz retweets it thinking it's an opportunity that he failed
18:56
to silence US citizens because the constitution stood in his way. Failed to silence students,
19:02
failed to silence green card holders. Let's go after visitor visas and short-term business visas
19:07
instead. When Ted Cruz retweets it, Amy Meckleberg and Laura Luma, those who despise Jesus Christ,
19:15
those who despise the Virgin Mary, come out and say, "Let us try and silence. Let's
19:20
take a scalp. Let's try and create fear. If the Constitution prevents us from going after green
19:26
cards and student visas, let's go after a British journalist instead." Laura Luma tweets and says,
19:31
"I've got a target. I've set my sights on them." on the Monday she tweets there is somebody who is touring the touring the United States who is talking against the Israelis we need to get him
19:42
out of the country you were with me at that time on the Wednesday 2 days later guys I'm in Congress
19:48
I've met with officials I have good news coming in 2 days then we go to Bay Area then we go to
19:53
Sacramento and then I arrive in San Francisco airport and as I'm looking for my gate to fly
19:59
towards Tampa a homeland security individual comes shows me the badge and says Mr. Hamdy, I
20:04
said yes. Your visa was revoked two days ago. Why was it revoked? No reason. The reason no reason is
20:10
because it's unconstitutional. What happened? What they're trying to do is they can't win legally. So
20:15
they thought, let's go for what seems to be an easy target. And then as a result, the detention takes place in ICE, which we can talk about later. Exactly. But but this is the point that I'm saying
20:23
in that the point is not Sam Hamdi. The story is much bigger than my detention took place in ICE.
20:30
you your question suggested that am I being overly optimistic when I say that the Israeli first lobby is losing what happened to me is a desperate hysterical attempt because they are
20:42
being thwarted at every single turn and they're trying to find any small win that might suggest
20:49
that they still have power because the Israel first lobby is losing to the America first and
20:54
that was even reflected in my case I know we'll talk about it later in which the reason I was able to return home is because despite what they were saying publicly in private they were saying Mr.
Why Sami was targeted?
21:04
please misunderstanding. Can we just clear it up? You go home and apply for a visa and come back to America. The point that I'm saying here is they are emphatically losing not because of any
21:14
malicious efforts on the part of the Palestinians, but because the American public no longer believes
21:21
that Israel should come first. They believe it should be America first. And they are increasingly coming to the conclusion that the greatest threat to America are not the Palestinians. The greatest
21:31
threat to America are the Israelis who insist that Americans should become bankrupt for the
21:37
sake of some age-old prophecy that they believe exists in which they should commit genocide in order to take land that a god they do not even believe in promised them 3,000 years ago. Sami,
21:46
so I think that you know the point you make there is is is very relevant. Um but but maybe there is
21:53
also an argument to say that they were targeting you because of your previous activism during the
21:59
uh American elections during last year's general elections in the United States uh where you went
22:05
around the country. you spoke to Muslim audiences uh from you know from New York to California and
22:13
everywhere in between where you were speaking about uh punishing the genociders and um you
22:19
know Subhan Allah I think that did have a great impact on uh the voting intentions particularly of
22:25
American Muslims but also of of very conscientious Muslims across uh non-Muslims across the country.
22:31
uh just talk a little bit about that because there'll be a number of people who come across this video and come across your uh form of activism or your advocacy for the first time
22:42
like what were you doing during those elections and and maybe just a quick uh you know uh addition
22:48
to that there were some very few minority people there were some who said that that was a mistake
22:53
because Donald Trump uh who came after uh Biden you were principally arguing that there should
23:01
that Biden and Harris should be punished. Donald Trump who comes along is the guy who
23:06
ultimately incarcerates you. Just talk to those two two things please. The first thing I will say
23:11
is I promise you that Sidra who had her legs blown off does not miss genocide Joe. Hendra that had
23:18
325 bullets shot at her car, six-year-old Hendra surrounded by the corpses of her family does not
23:24
miss genocide Joe Roh. The soul of my soul, as her grandfather called her, does not miss Genocide
23:31
Joe. More than 100,000 Palestinians slaughtered and bombed into oblivion. Do not miss Genocide
23:36
Joe. Palestinians kicked out of northern Gaza who were driven out as a result of a fascist, brutal,
23:43
Nazis-esque genocide, do not miss Genocide Joe. I promise you that those Palestinians sitting in
23:50
Gaza, do not miss Kamala Harris. those who saw the Americans impose a humanitarian truce with Anthony
23:57
Blinken when the Israelis were struggling to take northern Gaza in order to help to facilitate ethnic cleansing. By which Blinkin would say to the Palestinians, I'll give you 7 days to leave
24:06
northern Gaza so you can move to southern Gaza so we can hand over northern Gaza to the Israelis. I
24:11
swear to you those families, do not miss Genocide Joe. I swear to you that those who Palestinians
24:18
who saw Genocide Joe set up a humanitarian pier as he called it to help issue to help send US
24:25
Marines to help the Israelis take Gaza City when they were struggling to take Gaza City. I promise
24:31
you the inhabitants of Gaza City do not miss Genocide Joe. I swear to you, they do not miss
24:38
Kamala Harris. They do not miss the one who sent them the bombs. They don't miss the one who sent police to beat up the students in New York. They don't miss the one who sent the students to beat
24:46
up. They sent the police to beat up the students in Ohio. They do not miss Genocide Joe. Shame on
24:52
the one who misses Genocide Joe. Shame on the one who misses Kamala Harris. As to your other
24:57
point about the idea of what happened to you under Trump or the like. Do you think that two weeks detention or 18 days detention compares to what happened to the Palestinians in Gaza? Do you
25:07
think that me having yard time two hours walking around that and playing football and playing basketball? Do you think that suffering compares to what happened to Gaza to the Palestinians? Do
25:17
you think just because something happened to me for 2 weeks by which alhamdulillah I was able to return home to London that somehow I'm supposed to turn around and say, "Oh, I suffered so much
25:26
that I should just say to the Palestinians, oh, your genocide should have stayed in power. The one who slaughtered you should stay in power. Because I felt a bit of discomfort for two weeks.
25:34
Because my wife Sumea felt a bit of discomfort for two weeks. Because my parents, you know what my mother said to me on the first phone call that I had with her 4 days after I was detained. Even
25:44
through her tears, she said to me, I know that I am better than the mothers in Palestine. I know my
25:51
situation is better. That's what she said. I know that I have it because my son at least is alive.
25:56
That my son at least is there. I know in front of Allah subhana wa ta'ala that my complaint is less
26:02
than the complaint of those in the Palestinians and I should at least show appreciation for that. Shame on the one who misses genociders. Shame on the one who wishes we had rewarded them. Shame on
26:13
the one who wishes they were still in power. Shame on the one who wishes that the one who stood in
26:18
front of the press and when they said to him, "Mr. president, are you not worried that your support
26:23
for what the Israelis are doing in Palestines will mean you will lose the Muslim vote? And he said to them, well, where are they going to go? The other side wants to do a Muslim ban. That's who
26:31
you miss. That's who you wish was in power. That's who you wish was there. Why? Because Sei Hi went
26:38
to for two weeks went to because Mahmud Khaled is detained in a cell because the journalist. What is
26:43
happening to any one of us that compares to what's happening in Gaza? What? In fact, if we want to
26:49
talk politically, let's talk objectively. There is a tenuous ceasefire right now. And because of the president who's currently in power, because he insists on this ceasefire, now Erdogan has finally
27:00
sprung into action. Erdogan now is lobbying Trump to send a Turkish force to Gaza to finally protect
27:06
the Palestinians. And the Israelis are the ones panicking, begging Donald Trump not to allow a
27:11
single Turkish troop into Gaza because they're telling Trump, "If you allow Erdogan into Gaza,
27:16
we will not be able to annex it." Because now you have President Trump. You now have the Saudis,
27:22
UAE, and the Israelis all in disarray where the Saudis are telling Trump, "Mr. President, please
27:27
don't let Turkey into Gaza. Don't let the Turkish troops there. And if you let them in there, we will not spend a single penny to reconstruct Gaza because we want to see the eradication of
27:36
these Palestinians in Gaza itself. You think just because something happened personally that it
27:42
compares to the plight of the Palestinians? And the other point I will say is this. The reason why the Israel first lobby is losing is because of the rise of the America first lobby. Donald
27:52
Trump is a businessman. I'm not celebrating Donald Trump. I never argued that Trump would be good. I
27:57
argue that if you punish genocide today, you will create a momentum where the likes of a mammi will win. Mamani was the people who campaigned against him were not Republicans. It was Republicans and
28:09
Democrats. The Democrat leadership allied with Donald Trump. Look at the this is what I meant
28:14
when I said it's not Democrat and Republican. It has transcended Republican and Democrat because
28:20
Chuck Schumer and Donald Trump both stood with Cuomo. Hakeim Jeff, the Democrat minority leader,
28:28
stood alongside Donald Trump against his own party, Meani. Quuomo resented that the party
28:35
base chose Manny. So he revolted against the Democrat base by running against Meani. Vote
28:42
blue no matter who went out of the window. Not for the sake of America. America first means you vote
28:48
blue no matter who. Rather instead for the sake of Israel. Cuomo said, "I will divide my party and
28:54
break it into two rather than see America first. I will sacrifice for the Israelis and break my
29:00
party vote into two and run against Mamani." That phenomenon happens. Why? Because genocide mattered
29:07
to ordinary Americans. And it's not only the idea about genocide Joe or the lie. You remember when
29:12
Don Lemon interviewed that African-American lady after the election and said to her, "Who did you vote for?" And she said, "I didn't vote for nobody." And then he said,
29:20
"Well, don't you think that because you did that, you brought Donald Trump to power and you made America under threat?" And she says, "It's not my fault that the choice I had was between a genocide
29:29
and a fascist. Maybe the problem is not me. The problem is the system." Americans are waking up to
29:35
that. And I think many other people should wake up to that, too. And I think that with Donald Trump in power and forcing America to reckon between the Israeli influence and the America first influence,
29:45
it's a journey of struggle. And this is why I make this argument. Why is Marjorie Taylor Green and
29:50
Tucker Carlson and Candace Owens and these others, why are they revoling against Israel first? It's
29:57
because even though Donald Trump won, they cannot understand why the administration seems to lean
30:02
more towards the Israelis than towards the Americans. That fact has become starkly now
30:07
in the open. Harris herself is recognizing, you saw her speech, I think yesterday, the day before, where she said, "If we had changed our opinion on Gaza, we might have won the swing states.
30:16
If I had been allowed to say something in Gaza, I might have won." indicating she's aware that it matters to those Americans. It's changing the political dynamics. It's changing the political
30:25
calculations. The reason Apac is becoming a pariah is because people are recognizing that
30:30
the reason Harris lost is because of Gaza. So, I need to create distance with the Israelis if I want to win. That doesn't happen if Harris wins. The reason Harris lost is because of Gaza. So,
30:39
I swear to you guys, I'm not taking money from Apac. That's unprecedented on both Democrats and
Donate to Baitulmaal
30:44
Republicans. North Carolina representative, Massachusetts and these others, Apac Tracker now being monitored by ordinary Americans who are saying anyone who takes money from Apac, I'm not
30:54
going to vote for them. The reason that phenomenon is happening is because support for Israel has
30:59
become a political liability because for the first time ever in a presidential election, a candidate
31:05
lost because they supported the Israelis. So my point that I say here, the point that I finish
31:10
on on this point is this. Why is it that the Americans don't miss Genocide Joe, but some people
31:16
still do? Why is it the Americans are insisting that we punish Genocide Joe and now we don't want
31:21
to commit genocide anymore? Today I I read out the tweet in the car on our way here from a right-wing
31:26
Christian that I retweeted on my account where she says, "I don't want to grow up in a country where
31:32
you I have my taxes are raised higher because I'm supporting a genocide in the Israel." People are waking up. Why? Because people are talking on social media because it's having a political
31:40
impact and the like. And I think people, those who are still talking about the last election, I think the reality is that they're being left behind. America is moving further forward. The Israeli
31:48
lobby is breaking. Don't weep for the Israeli lobby. Rather, stand by America and let's continue
31:53
this fight. And it's the Israelis who are losing. And it's Palestine that's winning. For two long
31:59
years, Gaza has been under siege. Families cut off, homes destroyed, lives shattered overnight.
32:12
But from the very first day we were there on the ground with the people delivering food packages,
32:22
hot meals, clean water, medical aid, shelter, and hope. every blockade, every shortage, every
32:33
obstacle, we found a way through. Because when lives are at stake, giving up is not an option.
Muslim Americans and Elections
32:41
We brought not just aid, but dignity. We shared meals in unity. We cared for the sick and welcomed
32:50
new life. We gave children a safe space to be children again, to learn, to dance, to smile.
33:00
None of this was possible without you. Your compassion, your prayers, your generosity is
33:07
what kept families going through the darkest of days. For 2 years, we have stood with the people
33:15
of Gaza. Through every trial, through every heartbreak, and together we will keep standing
33:25
because hope cannot be besieged. and humanity will always find a way. Keep the compassion going.
33:36
Give today. Turn your compassion into hope. Visit btml. us/thinking Muslim to learn more and give.
33:46
So Sami, I do want to talk about your arrest and detention and the two weeks you spent in uh in detention, but um I just want to come back to a previous answer where you talked about
33:56
the Israel first movement and the America first movement and uh the advocacy work you were doing
34:03
uh prior to your arrest uh and that was really to focus on the midterm elections and and focus on
34:09
how Muslim Americans and conscientious Americans can vote in this coming election. Just underline,
34:16
just underscore what you want all people who are who believe in Palestine, who believe in
34:23
the Palestinian cause, who believe in uh in the fact that America should not be subverted by this
34:30
pro-Israeli politics, how should they be voting? I think first and foremost, what's important to
34:36
note is that I'm not an American citizen and it's not my place to tell the Americans how to vote. And I do think that when people talk about the advocacy, I think what's important to
34:43
stress is that the advocacy was in regards to the genocide that's happening in Palestinians
34:49
and in the spirit of oh Americans, oh those of good hearts, oh people of the land of the brave,
34:55
look at what's happening in the world, look at this inhumity, look at this injustice. How are you able to continue living your lives in this way knowing that your government is supporting this?
35:04
How do you continue living as if nothing is happening when your taxpayer dollars are going towards blowing off the heads of kids and blowing off their legs and blowing up their
35:12
mothers and their fathers and the elderly and the like? How do you continue going on as normal when it's your taxpayer money that is funding those weapons that is driving a people off the lands
35:22
that they legitimately belong to that is funding an apartheid and occupying regime that allows for
35:28
this these atrocities to take place that has been condemned by the ICJ and the ICC and what I found
35:34
in America was when Americans saw this when they heard this when they saw the realities of what was unfolding they literally would turn around and say well I'll be I had no idea they
35:43
they genuinely turn and said, "I can't believe this is happening." I've told the story many times of the lady in California who came with 30 members of our organization in tears saying,
35:53
"Mr. Hamdi, I never knew that this was happening. I can't sleep at night knowing that this is where
36:00
my taxpayer dollars are going, and I promise you that we are dedicated to stopping this particular genocide." Marjorie Taylor Green's argument, what is the argument? Why do I need
36:09
to go and bomb innocent Yemenes? Why do I need to go and bomb Palestinians? What have they done
36:14
to me that requires me to go and bomb them? Why can't I focus on America first? Tucker Carlson in his podcast. How is it Christian to argue that innocent civilians should be killed for the crimes
36:24
of a few? How is it Christian to say that these are just collateral damage? How can we accept a group that says they're the chosen people when we know that God created every man equal and will
36:34
judge everybody based on their individual actions? This is the advocacy. It's calling on the people,
36:40
calling on humanity to stand against injustice. When I was going across America, it wasn't about
36:45
telling Americans how to vote or how not to vote. It's calling on my brothers and sisters in humanity to stand against this vile injustice. The prophet Muhammad sallallahu alaihi wasallam,
36:55
Allah says in the Quran about him, we sent you as a mercy to mankind. Muslims are not Zionist.
37:03
We don't just talk to each other or preach to the choir. We go to these different societies to America believing in the goodness that Allah put in their hearts that we call the fra. We're
37:12
not Apac. You don't need to buy Americans. We're not Apac. You don't need to manipulate Americans.
37:19
We're not Apac. You don't need to buy Congress people. We're not Apac. We don't need to blackmail
37:25
US presidents. We're not Apac. We don't need malicious or vile tactics. We have the truth on
37:30
our side and we just need to talk to those people and social media allowed us to do so. What is Apac
37:37
doing? We don't need to buy Tik Tok. We don't need to buy social media. We don't need to manipulate
37:43
AI. When AI hears the word of truth, Grock turns around and says that this is a genocide that is
37:49
unfolding. Open AI says there is a genocide that is unfolding. All these AI tools, Times of Israel
37:55
reported that AI set up by the Israelis to respond to pro Palestinian accounts. Within two weeks,
38:01
it was saying that the people who made me are apartheid colonizing white oppressors. The reality is that that truth is more powerful than that money of Apac. And this is the reason why
38:11
the Laura Loomers, the Amy Mecklebergs and these others are so hysterical because they spend $50
38:17
billion to buy Tik Tok in order to counteract the truth that is delivered for free. It's not
38:22
about Semi Hamdi going around or the likes of Lean Muhammad, the likes of Zia and these others going around to sort these different you know events and the like and to go and talk to the people in the
38:31
somehow manipulating the Americans. It's listen my name is Sami. I have a message. I believe this
38:37
benefits both of us. The Allah subhana wa ta'ala sent the Muslims as a mercy to mankind including
38:42
to America and the UK and beyond. You are part of that Muslim vote movement that mobilized people
38:48
in the UK. You went and you knocked on doors. How many did you find from the British population of
38:53
all ethnicities, white, black, and the like who when they heard your message, they said, "You know what? I can't believe what they're doing. I'm going to be voting for Leyan and Ilford.
39:02
I'm going to be voting for Adnan Hussein in Blackburn. I'm going to be voting for Aub Khan." What is it that what did you do to convince them? You are knocking on doors. I've heard the stories.
39:11
I didn't hear anything about you paying a brick to go and vote in that regard. And that's why I believe this wholeheartedly that Allah subhana wa ta'ala when he says in the Quran about dawah that
39:21
it has the capacity to make the one who was your enemy into a warm ally, a warmest ally. I believe
39:30
what Allahh means is that you don't need to adopt those vile tactics. The reason why I said in that
39:37
press conference when I landed that I am thankful to the calm heads in the state department. I am thankful to those federal judges is to acknowledge that America is not Laura Luma. America is not Amy
39:47
Mckelberg. America is not the Zionist lobby. I went to every state in America except New Hampshire. I don't know why I keep repeating that but except New Hampshire. I went to the southern
39:56
states and experienced the hospitality. I went to New York. I found hospitality. I went to Seattle.
40:01
I was welcome. I went to Atlanta. I went to Indiana and I was welcomed. I went to Ohio,
40:07
all these different places. At no point, Zia is here sitting with us. At no point did I find an American who said, "Get out of here." Instead, they said, "I can't believe I didn't hear this
40:16
before." What the Zionist lobby is so terrified of is they establish five different filters of
40:22
information before it would reach the American. where the Palestinian says that they're being bombed and they're being killed. And then you have CBS which filters it and then you have the
40:32
ADL which filters it. Then you have Ted Cruz who filters it. Then you have Laura Luma who filters
40:37
it. By the time the American gets the piece of information, it's diluted. Social media enabled
40:42
us to bypass that. And this is why when you ask by the advocacy about Kamala Harris or indeed in the previous elections, in the words of a beloved American of ours, I won't name him here. All semi
40:52
did was say what we were all thinking which is there is a heinous genocide taking place. Those
40:57
who committed it need to be held to account. What is it that them those who supported Menni are saying or those who are supporting the Tucker Carlson and what are they saying? They are saying
41:07
guys it is inhumane to be supporting this Israel first lobby. Let's uphold the ICJ. Let's uphold
41:13
the ICC. Let's arrest the criminals. Let's uphold the values of humanity. This is something that
41:19
everybody can agree upon regardless of which religion that you follow. And this is why I argue that the Muslims are a mercy to mankind because the reality is that we believe in the
Moments before detention
41:29
power of the truth to prevail over milliondoll propaganda machines. You look at the boycott
41:35
movement. It wasn't just Muslims that boycotted. You go to different I remember going to an event finding Jewish Jewish people going around and boycotting Israeli goods. Why are you boycotting
41:45
them? Because we disagree with what's happening in Palestine. When I was in the detention facility, Media Benjamin and all these others who are coming out and saying it is a travesty what is happening.
41:55
It is a disgrace what is happening to Seami Hamdi. What are the religious bonds that tie us? None. What are the ethnic bonds that tie us? None. But what unites us? The desire to see the truth to
42:05
be upheld. And this is what I meant when I say when you asked the question earlier that is it am I exaggerating when I say that the Israeli first lobby is losing. Look at all the polls.
42:15
How many Americans now are turning away from the Israelis? Did anyone pay those Americans to turn away from the Israelis? Did anybody coers them to turn away from the Israelis? On the contrary,
42:24
more than $50 billion was spent to try to keep those Americans on board with the Israelis. And
42:29
the mobilization of a movement without any funding that was done for free by ordinary individuals is
42:34
breaking that million-dollar propaganda machine. And this is why I make this particular point. When we talk about advocacy, we imply that maybe it's about, you know, expressing your point of view
42:43
and seeing what's happening. I believe it's more than that. It's an appeal to the fra that Allah
42:49
has put in the hearts of every single human being. And the fact that that truth has the ability to
42:55
wake people up and no matter how much money the Israel first lobby tries to push in that regard,
43:00
the reality is they keep failing at every turn. Right, Sammy? So, let's talk about uh the arrest.
43:07
You were detained by ICE uh agents at uh the airport in San Francisco. So you left me around
43:15
11:00. I think we had pancakes that night, right? I IHOP. I I still don't understand that tradition.
43:20
Uh so we had, in fact, you forced me to to to get Zia forced us. Zia forced us, right? So we we had
43:26
those pancakes. We left around 11:00 or midnight and uh you were going to uh San Francisco to catch
43:34
a plane to Florida for another care event. We were in Sacramento because uh you and I were on stage.
43:42
um uh talking to a very big audience uh of uh it was a fundraising dinner for for care the council
43:49
of American Islamic relations and uh you were going to give another fundraising speech uh in
43:57
Florida. So what happened next? Take us through take us through those moments. So Laura Luma
44:06
during that week and we were together and and and we were looking at some of those posts had said
44:11
on the Monday that and we mentioned this earlier that there is somebody giving lectures around and criticizing the Israelis. We need to get rid of his visa and deport him. Then on the Wednesday she
44:19
said I'm in Congress and there's good news coming in two days. On the Friday we gave the talk in Bay Area. On Saturday we went to Sacramento. And then Friday uh I overslept. The flight was 7:30.
44:29
I overslept. It was 10 6. Uh Marwan, a good friend, had to come to the hotel and call me
44:35
from the reception to tell me, "Get up. You have a flight to catch." And then we drove, we got there
44:40
45 minutes before takeoff on the cutff point for the check-in. And mashallah, how he got me there, I have no idea. And then I checked in my luggage. I went through security. I'm wearing the wonderful
44:51
Malaysian batic at that time that Americans seem to think was a disco shirt. And then I look up.
44:56
I'm looking for the gate D38. And then there's a man sitting by some tree, plastic tree that
45:02
they have inside San Francisco airport. And he walks up to me and he says to me, "Excuse me, are you Sammy Hamdi?" And I said, "Yes." And he said, "Uh, your visa was revoked two days ago, so
45:14
now you are here illegally." I said, "What do you mean my visa has been revoked?" And no one told me my visa was under review. And then he takes out a piece of paper. He says, "This is the memo from
45:23
the State Department." So I read the memo from the State Department looking for the reason. It doesn't say any reason. and it just says section this of this act and whatever state department has
45:30
the right to revoke visa etc. So I said uh why has my visa been revoked? He said uh we haven't
45:36
been told we've just been told your visa has been revoked so now you're here illegally and I said okay in that case I'll just book a ticket now to London and go home and he said that's not how this
45:44
works. So I said okay and then I said what do we do now? He said now you have to come with us and then five other agents appear out of nowhere around me. So I look and I think but let me just
45:55
go home. He said that's not how this works. You have to come with us. So they escort me out of the airport and then there's a black car waiting for me with tinted windows. So they've surrounded
46:03
me and the car is in front of me and they say to me, "Get in the car." So I said to them that this looks like something from the movies. Uh I'm not saying that I don't believe who you say you are,
46:11
but I am a British citizen. I came here on a valid visa. Uh I need to make a phone call at least to a
46:17
lawyer. They said no phone calls. I said then I'm not getting in the car. I don't need to get into the car because you know I can just say you're not who you say you are. I need to make a phone call.
46:26
They got frustrated and one guy said, "You have one minute like this. You got one minute." So I thought, "Who do I call? Who do I call? Who do I call?" And then I thought, "Husse from K whenever
46:35
a Muslim has a problem. K is the organization that you go to and they're able to mobilize quickly."
46:40
So I messaged Husse and Husse to his credit replied to me in 10 seconds. I said to him, "Husam, they've detained me at San Francisco airport. They're telling me to get into a black
46:49
car. They're not telling me where I'm going. What should I do?" He said, "Comply, and we're on it." So, I said to them, "Okay, uh, I'll get in the car with you, but I just need to make a phone
46:57
call to my family to make sure they don't worry." As soon as I finish that sentence, a lady from behind me pushes me against the car. And she says, "All right, that's enough.
47:05
Now you're under arrest." And she cuffs me very tightly with my hands behind my back and they throw me in the car. When they throw me in the car, there's a ICE agent sitting on my left. And
47:13
the driver starts driving off. Sumea, my wife, she calls me and the ICE guard just declines
47:19
the phone. He had no idea how to shut down the Samsung. Thankfully for Samsung, they have a good
47:24
way of you can't lock the phone unless I use my fingerprint. I didn't tell him that. But anyway, we get to the ice processing center. They put me in a cell. Then I told them, "Can I call my
47:32
lawyer?" They said, "No, you can't call call your lawyer. You'll have your phone call eventually." They put me in a cell. They made me wait for a couple of hours. Then they brought me out. They
47:38
brought me a piece of paper. They said to me, "Uh, sign that you want to leave the country." I said, "I'm not signing anything. You guys revoke my visa without telling me. I'm sure that I have
47:46
some sort of relief. I need to call my lawyer. I'm not signing anything until I have my lawyer. They tried to push me to sign. I said, "I'm not going to sign." Then they said, "Okay, get ready. You're
47:55
going to be going to a facility." I said, "Where?" They wouldn't tell me. Then when I insisted, somebody said, "You're going to Bakersfield." I didn't end up going to Bakersfield. So, in the
48:03
end, they put me in the back of a van. And in the back of the van, it's not a big, you know, the way you think about it. It's the place that they put, they cuffed my legs, they cuffed my hands, they
48:12
put a chain around my body, and then they put me in the back of a van where it was about maybe 80
48:17
cm by about 3 m. And then we drove for 2 hours and a half. 2 hours and a half. The only thing I can
48:25
see is there's a small window in the back of the van with, you know, some like chains on it. So, I have no idea where we're going. 2 hours and a half pass. We arrive in a car park. They open the
48:34
door, they pull me out, and then they put me into a car where the back of the car is very tight. So, I have to sit like this. And again, I'm still cuffed. We drive for another two hours and a half
48:43
until we arrive to a place called McFarland, middle of nowhere. When we at this time, I'm to telling the driver, "What happens here? You're detained." And I said, "Okay, well,
48:53
when can I just go home? I book my ticket." "No, you're going to be here at least 2 weeks." I said, "Why am I here 2 weeks? My visa got revoked. They didn't tell me. They didn't pay no attention. They
49:01
ignored me. They turned the music volume up. And then when we got to the facility, I entered the facility. When I entered the facility, they make you change your clothes. They give you the blue
49:11
prison clothes and the like. And there were two Indians in the reception and the Latino. So they
49:16
were there before me. So the lady is checking them in one by one. The Latino guy goes and the lady says to the Latino, "So where are you from?" And as a joke, he says, "I'm from Afghanistan." And
49:26
she says to him, "Oh, your people want to kill my people." And I'm looking around the corner.
49:32
What? And then she says, "Your people, they want to kill Americans." And the Latino is panicking. So he says, "No, no, me no Afghan. I'm I'm I'm I'm from, you know, like Mexico or whatever." And she
49:42
says, "No, the people of that area, they want to kill all Americans." So I went, "Excuse me, that's just categorically not true." Like, she goes, "No, yes, they do." And then she checks in the Latino
49:51
and she checks in the two Indians. Then she goes and a man comes and checks me in, takes my phone, takes everything from me and the like. And then they keep me in the cuffs. Then they take me
49:58
into a hall and the hall has more than 90 people. They give you a bunk and then you stay in the bank themselves all this time. Can I call my lawyer? Can I call my lawyer? No call for the lawyer.
50:07
They have this pay phone that you use. They said you have three minutes free on this pay phone. So I called Sumea very quickly. My wife, I said to her, Sumeaya, I'm in detention. Don't panic.
50:16
I'm fine. Uh call Husse is already organizing. May Allah reward him. Care very quickly. Assemble the
50:21
legal team. I called Husam because Zia wouldn't pick up the phone. But anyway, I called Husam. He's sitting in the room and he looks very guilty about it. May Allah forgive him. But in any case,
50:29
I managed to call Abdullah part of our team as well. Abdullah called Zia and called Husse. Husse quickly arranged a team together. The legal team was ready. And then the they told me that this
50:40
is your bunk. I said, "Where's the pillow?" They said, "We don't have pillows. We're overcrowded." I said, "Okay, where's the blanket?" I rolled up the blanket and then I lay there. And then
50:48
that evening, the guard said to me, "Get ready, Sammy. You're going to Fresno." Now Fresno is
50:53
an hour 45 minutes away. They cuff your legs and they cuff your hands. And the I called the lawyer. I said to them, they're taking me to Fresno. So the lawyers panicked. So the inmates told
51:02
me that what ICE tend to do is if they believe that your case will win in court, what they do
51:07
is they transfer you from the facility before you can go to court in order to delay your appearance
51:13
in court. So there was a guy from Texas for example who usually have a master hearing,
51:18
then an evidence hearing, then a final hearing and the whole process takes eight, nine months as a result of the overcrowding. There was a synagogue brother called Salah. Salah was on his final
51:27
hearing for his asylum. ICE were worried he would win the case. So two days before his hearing,
51:32
they transferred him from Texas to California and now he has to start his master hearing all over again and the evidence and the ICE catch you on the loopholes. They don't catch you on the case.
51:41
Whenever they feel they're going to lose a case, they use a procedural loophole to keep you longer in detention. So my lawyers panicked. So they immediately went to the federal judge and said,
51:49
"We're worried that Sammy is going to be delayed through these tactics. We want a restraining order
51:54
on ICE. The judge, to their credit, at 11:00 p.m. at night, issued a ruling and said, "We believe
52:01
there are serious concerns about violations of the First Amendment, freedom of speech, and therefore we forbid ICE from transferring Sammy anywhere outside of California." Which was a big win
52:10
because the judge is automatically acknowledging there's risk of First Amendment rights. When I got taken to Fresno, what they do is they take you at 11 p.m. And they cuffed my legs so tight until
52:19
my legs became swollen. When you get there, they throw you into a cell in Fresno because ice are not there. Ice turn up 8:00 a.m. the following morning. They take you the previous night. They
52:27
put you in a cell that's about 5 m by about 4 m and it's triangular. So, it comes down this way.
52:34
And they put 15 of us in this cell. So, everybody is sleeping tight to each other. There's an open toilet where it it's open. Everybody can see what's happening. And uh it's very awkward
52:44
and somebody say, "Excuse me, guys. Can everybody turn around while I perform my bodily functions?
52:51
They keep you there and you sleep in the cuffs. When you wake up the following morning, I found my leg swollen. The ICE guy knocked on the door, calls you name by name, and you go in. And I said,
53:00
okay, sign this to go home voluntarily. My lawyer told me, don't sign because if you sign, they'll dep prioritize you. You'll stay there for 3 months. So then I said, I'm not signing. They
53:09
said, okay, your court is delayed by 4 days. It was November 6th. It's now November 10th. I said,
53:14
why? They said because we had to change something on your charge sheet. So my charge sheet said that
53:19
you are charged with overstaying after your visa was revoked. So I said why is my court date being
53:25
delayed? They said because on your charge sheet it says that you landed in Santa Ana, Orange County,
53:30
California, which is true. I said okay but I did land in Santa Ana, California. They said yes we've
53:35
changed it to you were pre-clared in Calgary, Canada, which is where I took off from. I said
53:40
well what difference does it make? Like it's such a minor detail. They said every time we edit, we have to delay the court. 20 seconds, 30 second interaction, they put me in the cell,
53:49
24 hours in those cuffs, and then they take me back. During that detention facility, on the
53:55
third day, I woke up 5:00 a.m. in the morning, and I had the agonizing pain on my whole left side.
54:01
And when I mean agonizing, I'm not the individual that goes to see a doctor whenever I have a cough or a cold. I get dragged to see the doctor. This one was unbearable. I actually thought that I had
54:09
maybe like popped a kidney or something. There's actually a funny exchange just to lighten the mood a bit. Uh Zia and Abdullah came to visit me. Zia is the brother who organizes all these trips. May
54:17
Allah forgive him. So Zia came to visit me after the news came that I was ill. So I'm explaining
54:24
to Zia said, "What happened?" So I said to him, "Ze, I was in agony. Zia, like really, you know,
54:29
Zia, I thought that my kidney had burst." And Zia grins. So I'm thinking, "What's this individual
54:34
grinning at me like? What's wrong with him?" And then Zia says, "Ah, alhamdulillah, Allah like cured you, but the kidneys at the back. It's not at the front." So, in any case, I woke up with an
54:44
agonizing pain and I genuinely thought something had gone wrong in my system or the like. So, I go to the guard and I say to the guard, "Excuse me, I'm in agonizing pain. Can I see a doctor?"
54:53
And they went, "Okay, we'll put your name down and we'll let the medical team know." Then I'm pacing. I'm trying to turn. Can I ease the pain? It's getting worse. I'm struggling to breathe now.
55:04
I'm pacing up and down trying for the pain. 1 hour passes. An hour and a half, people are waking up.
55:09
Sammy, are you okay? Sammy, are you okay? The seikhs, the Indians are coming up and saying, "Listen, Sammy, like take this ibuprofen. We think we know what's wrong with you. It's the food. It's
55:16
the food. The food is cuz the food was they'd give you sweet corn with black spots. They'd give you beans that look like they'd come like two days expiry. You know, the rice was undercooked. We
55:25
had the Dagistani brother whose tooth was broken because when he bit into the rice, the rice was was hard, like it hadn't been cooked and the like. And the inmate said the food used to be worse. So
55:34
anyway, after like 3 hours passed, I decided to call Sumeya. I called and I said to her, "Uhya, help me. Really wahi, I feel like something is seriously wrong with me. Go and tell the media."
55:43
When they told the media, the doctors came. So the guard beforehand, I had said to the guard, "Really, I need to see a doctor." And the guard looked sympathetically and she said to me,
55:51
"Look, if you want the doctors to come, cuz they're here, if you drop now on the floor,
55:57
they'll come running. Otherwise, they're not coming." So I said I won't drop but I'll call the media. When the media came so the doctors came and they were like really upset in that regard and
56:04
for the next six seven days I couldn't keep the food in my stomach. In any case I had the second
56:10
court hearing on the Wednesday. What happened on the Wednesday was I had applied the lawyers had
56:15
applied to the federal judge to have me released on the basis of I'm innocent until proven guilty.
56:21
The government appealed the right to see a federal judge. They went to the federal judge and said,
56:27
"You have no jurisdiction to assess freedom of speech because he's a foreign alien and
56:32
therefore it doesn't apply to him." The judge responded within the same hour and said that he does have the right to freedom of speech and we do have jurisdiction and quote, "We believe
56:42
there are serious concerns regarding the First Amendment that need to be looked at urgently."
56:49
The following day, the lawyers called me and said to me, "Sammy, I've done immigration law for 22
56:54
years. This has never happened to me before. It very rarely happens, but we've received a text,
57:01
an email, and a call from the lawyer of the Department of Homeland Security. You'll remember at that time online, they were throwing out all these different accusations. They had called my
57:11
lawyers to say, "Listen, we've read an article in USA Today written by Sammy's wife. uh we've seen
57:18
the videos and the media coverage that's taking place. Is there a way that we could strike a deal where we let him go home unchallenged and we just clear this up? Which was extraordinary. None
57:28
of what was said publicly was said privately. Privately it was can we come with to a deal. So
57:34
the lawyer said that Sammy will not sign voluntary departure because you guys will keep him there for
57:40
one month. The government lawyer said, "We promise you that if he agrees to go home, we will make
57:46
sure we will remove the removal order. We will remove the deportation order and I will personally
57:53
call the facility, which I've already done, and I can guarantee you he will be home in less than a
57:58
week." So I said, "Go back to them and say it has to be within 3 days." The lawyer went back within
58:03
3 days. And the government lawyer said, "Does that mean he accepts the deal? If we can get it done, can we just get this done? We just want to clear it up." And the government appointed a specific
58:11
lawyer for that case indicating how they viewed the gravity of the case. My lawyer said to me it's
58:17
clear that they are concerned that maybe this one there is a blunder. And the sentiment that I got from the lawyers and from the government lawyer was that somebody in the state department
58:26
and in department of homeland security had gone to the department and said what idiot listened
58:31
to Laura Luma and what idiot revoked this visa? What idiot caused this headache for us? And what
58:39
idiot has caused this mess? And let's send in a lawyer to clean it up because it doesn't look like
58:44
we have any evidence to justify the charges that we're saying online. When I said when I pushed for
58:51
the 3 days and the lawyer agreed on the Monday, we went to see the judge. I saw the judge via Zoom. Everything is done via Zoom these days. And the judge said, "Do you accept the deal?" I said,
58:59
"I accept the deal on the basis that I'm home within 3 days." The judge said, "Does the other
59:04
person does the other side agree?" The other side agrees. We signed the deal and within 48 hours I was home. Like I returned to London. But the point that I realized in there was two things. The
59:15
first was it was fascinating to see how what the government says publicly is not always what the
59:21
government actually believes. And that was clear from the way that the government lawyer interacted with us. And the second, the impact of the media on my experience at the detention center. Yeah.
59:31
The reason why I say this is on the first day when ICE took me and even the second day the guards were vicious. Even when I showed them that my legs were swollen when I knocked on the door because
59:41
ICE the way they run it is that they have ICE and then they have G4S who does the transportation and they have a third company called Gio which runs the facility when my legs got swollen and I
59:50
told the G4S guard loosened the cuffs. He told me get away from the door and he wasn't interested. In the night time they loosened it a little bit on our way back to the facility. When the media
1:00:00
attention came, they were very careful how they put the cuffs. Really, they were very careful about how they treated me, very careful about how to offend me. I remember even on the day that the
1:00:10
oped came out in USA Today, we had USA Today every single day except the day Sumea wrote the article
1:00:15
and the supervisor, the rumors were the supervisor did not approve it. The only reason the inmates found out is because 2 days later, I remember we had B1, B2, B3, B4. I was in B3, you could see B4
1:00:24
and you can see B1. There was I was pacing around the hall and then there was a guy on the other
1:00:30
side on the other there was like 10 of them and they're knocking on the window on the window and they Sammy Sammy Sammy I look and they slammed the USA Today paper light they said hey it's you it's
1:00:38
you are the journalist you're the journalist in that regard but the tragedy is that and and the reason why I don't want to focus too much on my own story the tragedy is that compared to
1:00:47
the other inmates I had it much better because of the media attention because of the media attention
1:00:52
I remember the inmates would take great pains to say your court case was delayed four days. Us get delayed by two months or 3 months. I remember there was a Latino brother called
1:01:01
Antonio. He used to destroy me at basketball and then I destroyed him at football. In any case,
1:01:06
soccer fear Allah. But in any case, Antonio had been in the US for 15 years, married to a US
1:01:15
citizen. His kids are US citizens. Yeah. He was on his final hearing. He'd been there 9 months. So,
1:01:21
he had been invited to update his details by ICE. When he got to the appointment, they grabbed him and they thrown him into the facility. He went to his final hearing and came back after 10 minutes.
1:01:32
We told him, "Anthony, what happened?" He said the government lawyer and the judge said they didn't have time to read all the evidence. So the judge went, "Well, let's reschedule for 29th of January,
1:01:40
3 months later." Correct. There was a man 47 years. He'd been in America, lived in Oklahoma
1:01:46
and lived in California, married to US citizen, kids are US citizens. He had a green card. Got
1:01:52
invited to update the details of his green card. Went to the ICE meeting and was detained by ICE and thrown into the facility. 6 months stuck there with no recourse to meet the judges.
1:02:03
There was a brother there called Denny Shamayov, 23-year-old Cheschnian. I don't know how much people know about Russia and Ukraine, but Raman Kadov of Cheschna is sending Muslims to fight on
1:02:12
behalf of Russia in Ukraine. And the Muslims of Cheschna do not want to fight in Ukraine. Neither do the Muslims in Distan. They're like, we have no beef with the Ukrainians. We don't want to fight
1:02:20
there. The court acknowledged that Denny cannot be deported because there is a genuine risk he might
1:02:26
be sent to fight in Ukraine. And in his words, I don't want to die a death of Jah, killing innocent people for a government that kills Muslims elsewhere. Denny for 9 10 months is struggling to
1:02:37
get before a judge who can decide his particular asylum case. Denny is stuck there waiting for a
1:02:42
court case on December 3rd and doesn't even know if he'll be able to be let out. ICE keep delaying
1:02:47
his case when it comes to moving forward. There is a brother in that detention facility. His name is Canadu Al-Mas. Can son of Almas Kanet's niece was raped by a police officer in Kyrgystan. He
1:03:00
went to complain to the police station. The police station refused to investigate the police officer who raped his niece. So he brought his family to protest in front of the police station. They beat
1:03:10
them up. He brought more family members. They beat them up as well and then they chucked him in prison and then they charged him with a crime and sent him a summon for him to go and appear
1:03:18
in court. So he fled. When he turns up in the US, he's been in detention now for 7 8 months waiting
1:03:24
to see a judge in order to recognize his asylum claim. and ICE keep delaying his process of seeing
1:03:31
the judge and now he's in the process of trying to apply to a federal judge for innocent until proven guilty. The case can be won but he's not being brought into in front of a judge to do so. I
1:03:40
remember there was another brother from Kyrgystan used to own three restaurants and a hotel. New president comes in, smashes his business. He comes to the US. The judge ruled that his asylum claim
1:03:51
is legitimate and he is supposed to be released. ICE responded to the judge and said, "We want to
1:03:56
keep him detained to look for a third country that is willing to take him and he remains detained as
ICE Detainees
1:04:02
a result." There is a Palestinian sister called Kordia who is in Texas. Kordia had a student visa
1:04:09
studying in America. Kordia was brought before a judge twice and the judge ruled twice that she is
1:04:16
supposed to be released from the facility. ICE refused to release her from that facility and
1:04:22
refused to allow her to appear in front of the judge in order for her to receive the order from
1:04:27
the judge that she must be released immediately because ICE are concerned that if she appears in
1:04:32
the judge again, the judge will issue an absolute injunction for her to be released immediately. We
1:04:38
had a guy called Steph from Texas in the US for 14 years, married to a US citizen. His son is
1:04:44
a US citizen, gets invited to a meeting with ICE and gets detained at that meeting. He goes to the
1:04:50
judge. The judge rules that his case he should be released and he's still stuck in detention because
1:04:55
ICE continue to say we want to find a third country. If we can't send him back to Congo, let's send him to Ghana. All of these cases of the inmates that you see, Dennis Shamaya, for example,
1:05:06
the chesh that I mentioned has been in detention for so long, he's now on mental health pills
1:05:11
because he's I don't know where I'm going. I don't know how I'm going to do so. Many of them can't even afford a lawyer. And in the words of one guy who was there when he saw us praying,
1:05:18
he said, "Why do you guys pray? God does not exist between these walls." The point that I'm saying is compared to the inmates that were around me, ICE acts with an impunity. And ICE is
1:05:28
aware that they can't win the majority of those cases, but it's in those loopholes that they try to catch you. And that's why during those 18 days that I was detained, I was aware of my privilege
1:05:38
in that regard. I was aware that I was lucky that the Americans came out for me for which I'm very grateful. The UK guys came out for me. I'm very grateful. National Union of Journalists came out
1:05:47
for me. I'm very grateful. Even El Jazzer came out for me and I'm very grateful. Mahi Hassan came out
1:05:53
for me and I'm very grateful. LA Times came out for me. I'm very grateful. Barry Gardner, my local
1:05:59
MP, I'm very grateful came out for me. Jeremy Corbin, Adnan Hussein, my father was relentless on
1:06:05
Twitter. My mother, my wife, who's an introvert. My wife doesn't like speaking in front of the camera, was doing the tours everywhere. My daughter in school was being bullied by her
1:06:15
friends saying, "Your dad is a criminal. He's in prison." She was putting up with it until the teacher stepped in and said, "His dad is not a criminal. His dad is a hero for standing up with
1:06:23
regards to the Palestinians, giving strength to my to my kids." I'm aware the pressure that was put on that, but I'm also aware how lucky I was. I'm aware that I had it. And the inmates would say,
1:06:32
"How lucky you are that there are people who talk about you. How lucky you are there are people who
1:06:38
haven't forgotten you. How lucky you are that people remember that you're still human. People
1:06:43
have forgotten Marwan who's stuck in Texas. People have forgotten. People have forgotten Husseam Abu
1:06:50
Safia in the Israeli prison who's being tortured and the like. People have forgotten Muhammad a US citizen 16 year old being detained in the Israeli prison. People have forgotten these individuals
1:07:00
stuck in the facilities. Because what I realized with ICE once the media attention took place when
1:07:05
ICE were taking me to the airport for me to finally go back home they spent 2 hours and a
1:07:11
half telling me sobb stories about how hard their job is ruining the lives of innocent people and
1:07:17
how they are a misunderstood people and they said please don't write badly about us let the world understand us I'll tell the world the reality of what you people are doing they felt that pressure
1:07:28
and this is what I mean when I say this story is not about Sammy and I'm very wary when people say
1:07:33
what happened to you Sammy. My story pales in comparison to these other people in those
1:07:38
facilities. It pales in comparison to genocide. I was not the one attacked by Laura Luma. Americans
1:07:45
were attacked by Laura Luma. It was an attack on their freedoms. It was an attack on their right to
1:07:50
speak the truth, their right to speak about the Palestinians. It was an attack on those inmates in the facilities to try and tell people these are criminals who need to be deported. I remember
1:07:59
we watched the CNN headline where Trump said that they are deporting criminals and everybody looked at each other and said, "Well, who's the criminal here? There are no criminals here in this regard.
1:08:07
They are a forgotten people." And I think this is why when we're telling the story about that particular detention, it's important to put it in its context. This was an attack on the right
1:08:16
to speak the truth to the American population. This was an attempt by Laura Luma and an extreme
1:08:22
Israeli lobby to prevent Americans from seeing the truth, to ensure that the lie endures. And
1:08:28
the reality is that they failed emphatically. The point I finish on is this. And this is the point that's worth mentioning after Wednesday. I didn't issue a plea. I didn't say I wanted to return
1:08:37
home. I left it and believe that the federal judges would exonerate me. The government came
1:08:43
panicking and said, "Please, let's just clear this up. Go home, apply for a visa, and just come back to America later." So, you can go back. I can go back to America. They made it clear that I can go
1:08:51
back to America. Just apply for a visa. You'll be able to go back. There is nothing on your record to So the point was the sentiment was not we want to deport this individual. It was listen let's do
1:09:00
a face saving me measure just go back home for we know you want to go back to home. I told him I do. I was supposed to go back home November 2nd. I've got work to do. I've got things to
1:09:08
do. I've got thinking Muslim podcast to do. I've got you know people to see you know and the like. You know London is a magnificent city older than any city in America. But in any case Zia
1:09:16
loves London. Zia loves London. Mashallah. These Americans they're becoming guided to the right way. I'm joking. But anyway semi- joking. But the point that I'm saying is that I had things to do.
1:09:24
They said we'll let you go and you won't be deported. No removal order. Come back as you wish.
1:09:29
Which is why Amy Mecca and Lauruma they lambasted the government saying why did you cave into that pressure? But there is I know I said this before but there is one final thing I want to mention.
1:09:38
I cannot emphasize how phenomenal care were. They were so fast in preparing the stellar legal team.
1:09:49
They were so fast in preparing the media release. They were so fast in reaching out to you here and
1:09:58
Jerry and Alam and all these others to prepare those clips to counter the propaganda that they were trying to push. They were so fast in reaching out to Shikaran and these others. They were so
1:10:10
fast in reaching out to my family to reassure them. They were so fast in getting Tay Ali in the
1:10:16
UK on board to make sure they would prevent any crossber discrimination taking place. They were
1:10:21
so fast in establishing a volunteer press team that was able to go to the media and raise my
1:10:28
voice in such a way that it became a roar. The um came running. Jalal, my wife told me on the phone,
1:10:34
Sammy, the um is moving. She said like the um is roaring. She said they're coming out for
1:10:41
you. PS and that's because when I called care they responded immediately. They rushed to my
1:10:48
aid and I am eternally grateful for everybody who stood by me. Because when I compare my condition
1:10:54
to the other inmates, the only difference was the um raised their voice for me and I was saved
1:11:00
as a result. When I was stuck there, the um did not forget me. And in the words of Marwan Nhar,
1:11:05
a very good friend of mine in Bay Area, amazing AI tech guy, Marwan Nhar was the last visitor to visit me the day after the judge ruled I was to be released. Marwan made a comment to me when I
1:11:15
said to him, "How's the mood outside?" He told me, "Sammy," cuz I thought my family were trying to reassure me. He said, "Sammy, hundreds of thousands of emails have been sent. Kharim from
1:11:24
Words of Justice has been pushing it. People have been lobbying. We had people in New Jersey writing
1:11:30
letters to representatives. Rohana's office sent me a letter saying can we speak on your behalf? Can you sign it? Rashid al came out in full force with the congress coming out and speaking MPs and
1:11:40
the like. He said he but si you know what's really magnificent. I said what he said there are people who've been messaging me after the news came that you were released and they said well I'll
1:11:48
be pressure does work. We do actually have power. The beauty of what happened is not that seami was
1:11:55
released. The um believes it has power and it used it. The um believed it could shake the government
1:12:02
and it did. The um believed it had the power to make change and it did. The um believed it
1:12:08
could break the Zionist lobby and it did. The um believed it could th Laura Luma and it did. The
1:12:15
um believed it could ruin Amy and it did. The um believed it could influence the media and it did.
1:12:21
The um believed that the fra would resonate and it did. The um believed that media Benjamin and other
1:12:27
ordinary Americans would come out in force and they did. The um believed that Brits would come out and they did. The um believed the Australians would come out and they did. The um believed that
1:12:37
Far Sharif and other protesters would go in front of the immigration facility and demand my release
1:12:43
and they did. The um believed that it could make an impact and it did. It was a tremendous victory
1:12:49
in that part in that there was genuine belief that the um could do something and that's why I was
1:12:54
able to be released so quickly and it's why the government the DHS were the ones who came to make the deal and then try to do a safe facing measure by saying at least he's out of the US. There's
1:13:04
something magnificent about what care were able to start and mobilize and something magnificent about
1:13:10
the way that the community was able to respond and this is why I mentioned those inmates. Imagine what you could do for Denny Shamayov. Imagine what you could do for Ketb. Imagine what you
1:13:19
could do for all of these different individuals, Antonio and the like if only you would speak about them. And this is why I believe that it's another evidence that Allah subhana wa ta'ala tells the
1:13:29
truth in the Quran when he calls on people to give the da. Da is not a spiritual phenomenon.
1:13:34
Da is a political phenomenon. To call on people to do what is right is a political phenomenon.
1:13:40
To believe that people's hearts can flip is a political phenomenon. To believe in the power of the voice to make changes is a political phenomenon because it is one of the most powerful
1:13:50
tools that an individual could have. I believe in divinity in everyday life. I believe that Allahh
1:13:56
is there. I believe that we are closer to you than your jugular vein as Allah subhana wa tala says.
1:14:03
And I had a couple of moments like that even when I was in detention to to lighten the mood a bit.
1:14:08
I remember uh I saw a dream on the Wednesday the day before the government came to offer the
1:14:15
deal. I saw a dream that me and Shamaran are in Valley Ranch Masjid in Dallas and I'm sitting down
1:14:23
looking out the window deeply concerned and Shar is looking out the window as well. He's standing I'm sitting and I can see people dressed in like black gear trying to enter the Valley Ranch masid.
1:14:35
Each time somebody, one of them tries to enter, a Muslim who's just finished his wudoo, comes
1:14:40
in front of the agent walks in. Then the agent tries to come in again, another two Muslims come,
1:14:45
they've just finished woo, and they've come in. And it keeps happening until the masid is full,
1:14:50
rammed, and they can't seem to get in. And then Omar stands and said, "They're here for Sammy.
1:14:56
Wallah, they won't take him." The next day, the lawyers called me and told me that the government has come and offered a deal. Interesting. Sha later contacted my wife and said on the same
1:15:04
night I saw a dream of a similar nature but when they offered the deal I was hesitant because I was
1:15:10
does this mean that I won or I lost or the like like how do I interpret this deal? So I was pacing
1:15:15
around the hall and there's this Bengali brother who used to come to me every night with conspiracy theories. So I'm walking by and he says to me his name is he said to me uh uh brother Sami today
1:15:27
you're not smiling like is this place getting to you? Look, here's the deal. I have a offer
1:15:33
from the government to go home, alhamdulillah, you know, with dignity. I'm just trying to say, should I push further because I know the federal courts will back me or should I go home to my
1:15:42
family, ease their stress, and regain my voice. He said, are you worried about the manner in which you're leaving? I told him, yeah, like I feel like I've won. Alhamdulillah, I have won,
1:15:51
but I want to make sure that the manner in which I leave is decisive. And he said, "Oh, but the
1:15:58
prophet Muhammad sallallahu alaihi wasallam when he left Mecca, he didn't exactly leave in in an ideal way, in the way that he wanted. They tried to deny his voice in Mecca. He knew he needed
1:16:07
to go to Medina to regain his voice and he came back years later to Mecca in full glory. Brother,
1:16:14
what are they trying to do to you? To take away your voice? As long as you're in here, you don't have your voice. Go to Medina and get your voice and just come back in glory the way the
1:16:22
Prophet Muhammad wasallam did. unless you think you're better than him. I called my lawy, I said,
1:16:27
"Take the deal. Take take the deal." And there are these aspects where I feel like, you know,
1:16:33
and and this is, you know, I know sometimes people say, "I like listen to semi analysis. I don't like the divinity aspect." I feel like things could have been worse for me and Allah made it easy.
1:16:43
I could have been in Texas instead of California. Allah made I was in California. And interestingly, Zia never puts me in a state longer than 3 days. This was the first time that Zia had kept me in a
1:16:53
state for longer than a week. I was lucky I was in California in that time. I was lucky that I wasn't
1:16:58
transferred to Texas. I was lucky that the weather was good. I was lucky that the inmates deeply
1:17:04
sympathized. I remember on the first day they were playing football. Don't say it. I was playing
1:17:10
football and I was chosen last. People looked at the physique and they went, "Okay, do you want to
1:17:15
be goalkeeper?" The next day they were fighting over me as first pick. Really? Alhamdulillah. Listen, you haven't seen me pray. But anyway, the reason why I say is that very quickly, you know,
1:17:25
I remember the first day when uh after I got ill, the Muslim brothers came to the box and they were
1:17:31
like, "Brother, food here, rubbish, rubbish food." And they just filled my tray with the stuff that they had got from the commissary outside, you know, like tuna, sardines, and the like and
1:17:40
whatnot. when they saw that I was struggling like I was like I need some fruits apples they'd come and load it with apples or bananas you know they would trade you know three breads for a banana you
1:17:47
know they trade like a Snickers bar you know for apple this kind there was a lot of solidarity in that regard they had a custom where anybody who was released or was deported they would cheer for
1:17:55
him and celebrate and they'd all go to each other and say how's your court case where are you going etc but the reason why I spent a lot of time talking about those inmates themselves is what
1:18:03
broke my heart was the way they said please send me when you leave talk about us like let people know we're still alive let them know that we are humans that we have humanity. Not all the guards
1:18:12
are friendly with them. Some guards go looking for a fight with those inmates. Come on, do something. Like, what are you going to do? Bullying those guards every single day coming in and they come
1:18:21
and shout them and they turn the bright lights on to make sure you can't even sleep properly. There's a it's designed to humiliate them. And this is the point that I make and I finish on
1:18:29
this point with regards to ICE. ICE know that they cannot that the cases of the inmates will win if
1:18:35
they go in front of the courts. So, what they do is they do a battle of wills. If ICE can delay you from going to court for about 10 11 months, the inmate will give up and go home by themselves
Thinking Youth
1:18:46
and therefore there's no need to bring them to court. There was an Usuzbek guy 70 years of age who'd been there one year, one month. By the time I arrived, he was begging ICE, please just send me
1:18:56
home. I'd rather risk prison in Usbekistan than to go and stay with you guys over here. Please just
1:19:01
send me home. Damn the day I came to America. I thought this was land of law and it tells us it's not land of law. They tried to break you mentally. I remember there was a chin brother called Rasul
1:19:10
who said, "I know that they're trying to wear me down until I give up, but I know my case is legitimate for asylum. I've been here 10 months. Every day he just plays solitire with the cards
Prisoners
1:19:18
to pass the time." He says, "I know that it's a waiting match. I'm waiting until I eventually go to court because I know I'm going to win. It's just hard to keep up that waiting game."
1:19:27
What ICE do is they keep delaying, delaying, delaying, and it's who's going to blink first,
1:19:33
who's going to crack first. And that's the tragedy of what's unfolding in that if law is applied,
1:19:39
most of those detained by ICE get released. If law is applied, most of those people go back to their
1:19:44
families. If law is applied, they all tend to go. But there's not enough people talking about them in that regard. And that's why I ask anybody who's listening, anybody who's interested in doing,
1:19:54
go and find these inmates, go and visit them. If they're lacking a lawyer, spend some money to help them get a lawyer. I remember, for example, Denny Shamaya, for example, has a solid case,
1:20:03
but he's only got witness statements from his family and from his mother because he can't afford to get an expert witness report to confirm that he would be sent to Ukraine. And he can't get
1:20:12
a country report to add to his case because it costs $2,000 or $1,500 in order to secure those
1:20:18
documents. Peanuts when you see compared to how they fund raise in America as we saw, but it makes a world of difference to his particular case. cannot beg is preparing his habitus by himself
1:20:28
because he can't afford a lawyer because he paid a Russian speaking lawyer who ran off with his money. It only costs less than $1,000 in order to provide him with that advice that he needs to
1:20:37
ensure he's able to reunite with his newborn and his family. It's not that they can't win their case. It's the um needs to hear their stories and the um needs to pay attention. And that's why care
1:20:48
have taken on some of those cases. When I came out, I told them, "Here's the alien numbers and here's this and anybody listening who's interested in helping these people out. Help them. They need
1:20:56
it." I remember, just give you an example. I told them on the Friday, "Guys, so when's Jum?" And the Muslims looked at me, "What jum?" I said, "Like, when's where's where's Juma?" They said,
1:21:05
"Brother, no one's done Juma here for a year." I said, "Why?" They said, "I imbut
1:21:12
like it's an obligation." They said, "Wallah, nobody here knows how to do Juma. We don't know the dua you're supposed to say like in the beginning." I said, "Yeah, I gather them. Like,
1:21:20
we'll just do a Juma right now." And I remember Denny and Kenneth looked and they were like, "I had forgotten how wonderful Juma feels. I forgot what it's like." What that detention center
1:21:30
makes you realize is we take a lot of things for granted. There's a lot of hours in the day. A lot of hours in the day. When we're outside, we always thought it was like was like you got to be here,
1:21:38
got to be here, got to be here, got to be here, got to be here until like Z, you know, when he drinks so much coffee and he's like this, you know, like by the end of his coffee drink. But I'm
1:21:45
going to get heated heat for this. But but there there's so many hours in the day and it makes you appreciate it. Two weeks felt like two months but again I am aware of my privilege. The um came out
1:21:55
for me. I hope it comes out for those inmates. I mean I I must attest to K's um amazing just
1:22:01
the amazing work they did. Even you know I was with you and of course there was some worry that uh I would also be arrested uh at the airport and care assigned me Basim. We know Basin very well
1:22:11
and subhan Allah he stayed with me to the very end like to the gate and alhamdulillah you know he he
1:22:18
and Zara Bilu who's your lawyer of course as well you know these brothers did Ley Mariam and these
1:22:24
others did some amazing work alhamdulillah and and also I attest to you know we were wondering like
1:22:30
how are we going to get this out to the media okay you know we don't have great media experience you know how are we going to and subhan Allah the the way in which the team came together was amazing
1:22:39
I think it was Leila Hadad uh who volunteered. She said, you know, I've got some experience here. I'm going to and she got uh Amber on board and then Amber got Nick on board and subhan Allah,
1:22:50
that team was was a quality team. I mean, it's like an amazing team. You met Nick and and Amber
1:22:55
yesterday and you met Nick when you came back and subhan Allah, they they put in a lot of work and a lot of effort. I I just think, you know, the way this came together uh was was amazing.
1:23:06
But something you said resonated with me. Did you know that there were prisoners, there were people,
1:23:12
you know, kept in these ICE detention centers for 10 months plus? Uh, Sister Lar, you know,
1:23:18
we hear about her from because of Shik Omar's, you know, the work that Shik Omar does. But,
1:23:24
um, you know, it's shocking to see that she's been exonerated on two occasions, yet she still languishes in one of those detention centers. I mean, did you know about this? Because we've never
1:23:33
spoken about this in in any of our interviews, Sammy. One of the things that so I was uh
1:23:39
refreshing on the story of just to like see given the experience that I went through has it altered
1:23:47
the way that I read the story of some of these individuals and I got to the part where Katab does his tours in the night time of the different areas and we talked about this earlier in the car
1:23:56
and you described it as he's looking for the crooks and you know crannies and these other places and you get to the the story where he finds the woman on the street who's trying to trick her
1:24:04
kids into sleeping by pretending to cook food. Mhm. We used to read that story and be like, "Oh,
1:24:13
how wonderful he is." But is doing something very political. Are there anything? Is there anything
1:24:18
happening around me that I'm not aware of that I should be aware of? Let me go hunting for what I
1:24:24
should know. What that experience those two weeks, those 18 days in particular, is that I had never
1:24:31
paid attention to the plight of people in those areas. I had never necessarily come across it. It
1:24:37
was never necessarily in my sphere of interest. When I look at my own experience, the way the media came out, the way we were able to mobilize those and even the journalists that I've spoken
1:24:45
to, when I said to those journalists after the interviews, can I give you these names and these alien numbers? Can you report on their cases? They said, "Of course, of course." Because what my case
1:24:54
showed is you apply enough media pressure and you apply enough legal pressure, these people will get
1:24:59
out quickly. Mhm. The inmate said, "You got out in 2 weeks because of what everybody did outside. Otherwise, you would have been here 6 months, even if you're a British citizen." Which goes to show
1:25:07
that could be out very quickly if the um mobilized in that same way that Marwan could be out quickly
1:25:14
if the um mobilized in that same way. That then he could be out quickly if the um mobilized in that same way. But the question that I pose myself is how many of us who celebrate go out and explore
1:25:26
what are things happening around us that perhaps might warrant our particular attention where we
1:25:31
might necessarily deploy it. You gave the example earlier I was lucky in this regard I won't say like Allah planned it in this way. Well Allah subhana wa ta'ala brought all these different
1:25:40
people I'd never met who volunteered to say I want to serve in this cause. I want to get Sammy
1:25:45
out and all these various different talents. I remember when Husse came to me and said, "What do you think the strategy should be given your background in politics?" I said,
1:25:52
"I'm isolated. I don't know what's happening. My life is in Allah's hands and then your hands. You know better. You go and do it." Because everybody had their specific talents to go about. I think
1:26:02
the issue of whose rights are being violated. Men walk into the facility and don't even give
1:26:08
her time to wear the hijab. Her religious rights are being violated and it's and she's having a
1:26:13
torid time. When that Georgetown professor got detained by ICE, when Omar went to see him,
1:26:19
he told Omar in comparison to I'm having it good. She's suffering badly in terms of what's
1:26:25
happening. The reality is that how can we mobilize the same for can we mobilize the same for what's
1:26:32
can we find a way to link it to Abu Safia and get him released in order to keep that momentum going up? Because if they tried to accuse me of those heinous things as they did and we were able to
1:26:43
crush that propaganda in such a way that the American government came and said please Mr.
1:26:48
Let's just make a deal, go back to London and come back afterwards. It means the ummah has power. We can do it. We have the tools and the ability to do it. And this is what I've always argued
1:26:57
here in thinking Muslim. It's not that the ummah doesn't have power. It's about whether we choose
1:27:03
to deploy that power. It's not whether the Arab states have the power to stop the genocide. They
1:27:08
do. It's whether they choose to deploy that power to stop that genocide. It's not about whether we
1:27:14
have the power to get out on the basis of law and the federal judges. It's about whether we choose
1:27:20
to deploy that power to reinforce that federal ruling to get her out and restore her rights
1:27:26
as our sister. We were having a conversation in the car earlier about an interaction on Tik Tok between a Muslim Tik Tocker and the Muslim sister, a Muslim brother Tik Tok, a Muslim sister,
1:27:36
Tik Tocker, something about divorce and they were attacking each other left, right, center. And we were talking in the car and we said sometimes we forget that sister you're attacking is your
1:27:45
sister in Islam is your sis is your right and you should treat her accordingly. That's our sister in
1:27:51
that detention facility. The irony is that well the one who runs those facilities is actually a Muslim who doesn't care about their particular plightes but irrespective if you guys got me
1:28:00
out in two weeks how quickly could you get out? If you got me out in two weeks, and I say you,
1:28:06
you and everybody else who's watching this, those who raised those voices, who wrote those letters,
1:28:12
those who went and lobbied their their congress people, those who went and made sure that the world knows who Sami Hdi is. Laura Luma did me a favor. I reach audiences I could never have
1:28:21
reached on my own. Allah, may Allah guide her just for that. But the point that I'm saying is if you
1:28:26
could get Sami Hami out in two weeks, let's get out. If you could get Sami Hamdi out in two weeks,
1:28:33
let's get Marwan Maharu out. If you could get Sami Hamdi in two weeks, let's get Husseam Abu
1:28:38
Safia out. If you could get Seami Hamdi in two weeks, let's get these people out. Let's make it
1:28:43
our priority. Let's do what did instead of just reading about it. Let's go and find what's in
1:28:50
our community. What can we deploy? My wife said something to me yesterday when we were sitting down. You've met my wife, introvert. My wife is not as interested in politics. My wife's interest
1:29:01
is halal travel guide with the tourism stuff and you know and I'm glad they didn't marry somebody who's so interested in that politics in that regard. In any case, I saw I saw Zgo. You see
1:29:11
how he plugged it in. In any case, Sumea said to me that when I was told to go do the media
1:29:18
runs because somebody proposed her, she didn't volunteer although she wanted to. Somebody said Sumea might be good in this regard. Sumea said, "I didn't realize we could have that power. I didn't
1:29:28
realize we could have that influence. I didn't realize that if we all come together, we could make the American government come and sue for a deal with you." I feel like the um is beginning
1:29:39
to realize we have far more power than we actually think we do. And this is the frightening thing on
1:29:46
your if we say to Allah, "Allah, I didn't do such and such because I didn't have the power to do so.
1:29:55
I fear Allah will say you actually did have the power to do so. You just chose not to do it. You did have the ability to talk about these individuals. You chose not to do it because you
1:30:04
weren't interested. You enjoying animal fat chips or fries in In-N-Out Burger instead. It wasn't
1:30:10
your priority in terms of what you were doing. It wasn't something you thought that was worth your time. And that's why what this experience made me realize is Allah subhana wa ta'ala has blessed
1:30:19
this um with many different talents. And when it comes together, it can shake the whole world. So let's shake it for the sake of she deserves it. Let's shake it for the sake of she deserves
1:30:29
it. We shook it forstine and they deserve it. Let's shake it for Sudan. Let's shake it. Let's
1:30:35
show the power of this um as a mercy to mankind and watch how Allah sends allies from all these various different places. May Allah release them soon. Amen. Sammy, are you bitter? Not at all. I
1:30:47
I always on the Tuesday before I was arrested, I was sitting with uh Maz Mktar from Bet. We were
1:30:55
in the car together, just me and him. And he asked me quite sincerely. He said uh how you holding up
1:31:02
like how are you? And I said to him, uh Shikhen, I feel like there are clouds that are swirling above
1:31:11
me. I feel something is coming but I can't put my finger on it. And I said something similar to you
1:31:16
in Sacramento the night before. And he said to me, "Whatever happens, Allah subhana wa ta'ala
1:31:22
will always guide you through it." I said, "I'm not worried about what's going to happen. I'm worried about my capacity to get through it. I'm not worried about what will happen. I'm worried
1:31:32
will Allah give me the fortitude to push through with it." The reason why I keep reiterating the
1:31:37
decision about Sammy is because what happened to me does not compare to what happened to
1:31:42
the Palestinians. It doesn't compare to what's happening in Sudan. It doesn't compare to Mahmud
1:31:48
Khal and being separated from his family for those four months that he was detained. It doesn't
1:31:54
compare to it doesn't compare to Marwan Maru and these other individuals. I told you that my mother
1:32:00
had stated that my situation is better than other mothers. Other mothers are burying their children. My son at least is in California in a facility and at least he's playing football, basketball, maybe
1:32:10
struggling with the food, but there are inmates who are looking after him. I was aware in that regard. I always thought if it happened to me, I'd be terrified. But I remember I told Z when Z asked
1:32:19
me when he came to visit, he goes, "It must have been a frightening experience." I told him, "No, the frightening part was I wasn't frightened. I was I was sort of waiting to be scared, but but
1:32:26
but I wasn't. I'd lay there at night and I'd say Allah is this a wasting time or is it a test in
1:32:33
that regard but it was a valuable lesson in that even if I was out of action in that cell everybody
1:32:39
was moving all of you guys here and and yourself and he's like they were move the um is not on my back there's a wonderful story that one of my most beloved and closest friends one day we were
1:32:51
sitting together and uh I always sit with him to consult whenever I have things I want to clarify
1:32:57
and filter It's not that he has the answer, but he helps me ask the right questions. So, of course,
1:33:03
he was an imam of the biggest masid in Boston for a while on the east coast and then now he's in New Jersey or New Jersey. But in any case, once I I made this point and he said to me, you know,
1:33:14
when I was imam, people would come to me with all these different issues. You know, uh my father is
United Ummah
1:33:20
on life support. Is it halal to take him off life support? The doctors are saying take him off. Uh I was raped. uh is it halal to have an abortion? He said I lay there at night saying did I kill a
1:33:30
man or did I abuse the woman by you know like make her live with her trauma or things like that. And
1:33:37
he said it really got to me. So he goes one day I went to Istanbul. I was sitting with Mktar Mawi in
1:33:42
I think which whatever masid they were in. And he says, "I spent two hours pouring my heart out to
1:33:48
Shikh Mktar," telling him these are, you know, the woes and whatever and the difficulties and
1:33:54
oh and this and whatever and the state of the um whatever. He says, "I finished." And Mktar said
1:33:59
to me, "Are you done?" And said, "Yeah." So Mktar says, "You see these graves behind us?" And says,
1:34:08
"Yes." Mktar says, "Those graves are full of people who thought they were indispensable.
1:34:13
They passed on. The um continued they passed on and people kept going. The um has Allah subhana
1:34:19
wa tala. If you're not up to responsibility, you leave Allahh bring somebody else in your place. There was one something wonderfully refreshing laying on that bed knowing that everything was
1:34:29
continuing even if it was without you. Knowing that things were still moving. Knowing that the um was continuing to move. Knowing that maybe I'd served my purpose in this regard and now
1:34:38
it was Zia's turn. It was Muhammad Jal's turn. It was Alam's turn. Ursa's turn. Lean's turn, Riaz's turn, all these others. Abu Bak, it was all the these people's turns. I remember Abu Bakr,
1:34:49
a beloved beloved friend of mine from university days who languishes in Raleigh. You won't like
1:34:54
that I said that took the plane came to to flew 5 hours to come and see me and told me
1:35:00
I've mobilized El Jazzer in this regard. I've got the first article, second article, third and I'm lobbying and I'm pushing and they did a wonderful coverage of everything that was happening. His
1:35:08
eyes lit on fire and came alive. You met the other day, you know, who with works with Ramadan
1:35:14
tent project, also works at Shell. Mobilized to get all these letters of references. Everybody moved and mobilized while I was laying there, you know, in that in that bunk, you know, wondering,
1:35:23
you know, Allah, you know, alhamdulillah, I'm not complaining, but how long will I be here,
1:35:29
etc. There was something wonderfully liberating in that Allah is the lord of this ummah. Allah looks
1:35:36
after this um there is in this um when you said do you feel bitter? I don't feel bitter. I feel
1:35:42
vindicated. I always argued there is in this um I hated when people said the um is weak. I hated
1:35:48
when people said what's the point of this um look how power is. I rejected those arguments. I said no it's not true. It's categorically not true. And I felt that love from the um the way they
1:35:57
mobilized from from Malaysia. The funny thing is the video that set all this off was from Kindred
1:36:04
stories when me you and Ki were sitting together in Koala Lumpur. I remember messaging and telling
1:36:09
him you've got a Zionist audience too. Mah sitting in Koala Lumpur you know Shave is here with us you
1:36:16
know from Koala Lumpur as well and we were talking just earlier during the break when I was like to him hey you guys in Koala Lumpuro are affecting Ted Cruz in America as well. There's something
1:36:24
wonderful how two rand not random guys, the beloved brothers, but two guys sitting in Koala Lumpo can make Ted Cruz panic in Texas. It's almost as if we believe this um to be separate
1:36:35
and divided. But look how beautifully united it is. I had people lobbying from me from Jakarta,
1:36:41
people lobbying from me from DHA, people lobbying from me from London, people lobbying from Ankara,
1:36:46
people lobbying from various different the um moved. They moved and they roared until the
1:36:52
American government said, "For goodness sakes, let's get this guy back to London. Let's just
1:36:58
get rid just just end this. Please just take the deal and go." What bitterness, how beautiful this
1:37:05
um is. How beautiful when it moves. How beautiful when it puts you on their shoulder and says, "Wah,
1:37:11
you won't touch Sammy. Wallah, we won't let you have your way with him. Wallah, he is beloved to us. Wallah, he is a beloved brother. and wallah we will never let you touch
1:37:20
him. People who did not even like me came out. My brother Mei Hassan, my brother Harris, my brother,
1:37:27
all these people came out and said, "Regardless of whatever differences we have with Sami, he's our brother and we stand with him." A beautiful article that Zeteo wrote. Beautiful
1:37:37
Facebook post written by people who criticize me even during the election period because when all is said and done, it's a beautiful ummah. It's an extraordinary um I told the lawyers,
1:37:48
"How will I pay you? I don't know if I can even afford you. They said, "Brother Sammy, the community already has that sorted. The community are lining up saying,
1:37:56
"Whatever he needs, take it." How beautiful this um is. How wonderful it is. What a wonderful
1:38:06
um of the prophet Muhammad sallall.aii alaihi wasallam that defied the American government that
1:38:13
mobilized the world in my favor that mobilized the media in my favor that crushed Laura Luma's
1:38:21
efforts that crushed Amy Mech that crushed Tel Aviv in Israel that crushed their ability to
1:38:27
silence me and all others that continues to win because its lord is Allah subhanana wa ta'ala
1:38:33
there is in this um it's a beautiful um it's an um that when it moves the world shakes and it's
1:38:41
so um that finally believed in its power. When Marwan Nar said to me that people are messaging
1:38:46
saying I can't believe we actually did it. I can't believe we actually pressured the government to release him. How do you doubt that belief when the Lord is Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala? There
1:38:56
is nothing to be bitter about. Bring whatever you have. Bring whatever army you have. Bring
1:39:02
whatever media you have. I have Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala and the um of the prophet Muhammad Sami.
1:39:11
Thank you so much for all that you do and for your time today and alhamdulillah Allah uses us and may
1:39:19
he continue to use us. Amen. Amen. Now before we end, a quick and urgent reminder. K the Council
1:39:26
on American Islamic Relations played a crucial role in advocating for Sami Hyundai's release and
1:39:32
even supported me when there were fears I might also be detained. Sami's case shows what so many
1:39:38
families face. ICE raids, unlawful detentions, and a climate where speaking up for Palestine gets you
1:39:44
censored or punished. care is on the front line defending civil rights, protecting free speech,
1:39:50
and standing up for our community when it matters most. But they need our support to expand their
1:39:56
legal team and keep fighting. Please donate today. Follow the link on screen or in the pin comment.
1:40:03
Stand with care. Please remember to subscribe to our social media and YouTube channels and head
1:40:10
over to our website thinkingmuslim.com to sign up to my weekly newsletter.